Vintage Guitar and Bass forum

pots for a ripper

pots for a ripper
« on: April 16, 2007, 08:27:41 PM »
I'm rewiring a ripper and need a tone pot and a volume pot would this be appropriate for the ripper, i know pots aren't a big deal, but i want them to be right

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/Gibson-500kOhm-Potentiometer-Audio-TaperShort-Shaft?sku=306112

doom

  • ****
  • 264
    • View Profile
pots for a ripper
« Reply #1 on: April 18, 2007, 09:58:05 PM »
The correct pots for a Ripper would be 300KA for volume and 250KA for both tone pots.

Dave W

  • ****
  • 433
    • View Profile
pots for a ripper
« Reply #2 on: April 19, 2007, 02:45:22 AM »
And please note that the volume pot is 300K linear taper. Contrary to what you might read elsewhere, that's what Gibson has used since 1973, with the possible exception of some historic collection reissues.

jules

  • *****
  • 3068
    • View Profile
Gibson part lists
« Reply #3 on: April 19, 2007, 02:55:44 PM »
The Ripper pots are listed in two sets of parts lists, 1977, and 1981

summarised here
https://www.vintageguitarandbass.com/gibson/potentiometer/by_guitar/L9-S_Ripper


It is possible that these pots described as audio are linear (printed matter is never perfect - Gibson regularly described chrome as nickel etc)

i'd be interested to know why you say this Dave? And why do you say 73 as the change date?

interesting.....

Jules

Dave W

  • ****
  • 433
    • View Profile
pots for a ripper
« Reply #4 on: April 19, 2007, 05:11:46 PM »
Jules, my info on the pot being linear and the date of change comes from a discussion on another forum two or three years ago. Unfortunately I don't believe it's archived.

But if you google for Gibson 300K Linear Taper you'll see that the replacement pot they sell is linear, not audio taper. And if you go to Gibson's site and look at the first Les Paul schematic, you'll see a note on the schematic .pdf that models after 7-1-73 use 300K.

pots for a ripper
« Reply #5 on: April 19, 2007, 05:28:35 PM »
So far for genuine Gibson replacement pots all i can find are the 300K LINEAR STD POT, no 250.  Would the 300 work as well for the tone as well as the volume instead of a 250?  And do i want a long pot or short, I'm pretty sure its short, but i thought I'd ask.

Dave W

  • ****
  • 433
    • View Profile
pots for a ripper
« Reply #6 on: April 20, 2007, 12:34:20 AM »
Quote from: gibsonbass76
So far for genuine Gibson replacement pots all i can find are the 300K LINEAR STD POT, no 250.  Would the 300 work as well for the tone as well as the volume instead of a 250?  And do i want a long pot or short, I'm pretty sure its short, but i thought I'd ask.

The 300K linear pot is for a volume control.The tone control should be audio taper. Gibson doesn't currently sell a Gibson-packaged 250K tone pot in their accessories line (only a 500K), but Gibson never manufactured their own controls anyway. If it's important to you that it comes from Gibson, you might call them and ask if it's available from their parts department direct.

Can't help you on the long or short shaft since I've never looked inside a Ripper.

jules

  • *****
  • 3068
    • View Profile
pots
« Reply #7 on: April 20, 2007, 03:23:30 AM »
Quote from: gibsonbass76
So far for genuine Gibson replacement pots all i can find are the 300K LINEAR STD POT, no 250.  Would the 300 work as well for the tone as well as the volume instead of a 250?  And do i want a long pot or short, I'm pretty sure its short, but i thought I'd ask.


to be honest, I don't think pot resistance values are too important... the reason I say this is that in the course of compiling the information for the pot database, there are several instances of Gibson changing pot values, without changing other components.

I suspect if you had a situation where you had two tone or two volume, the pots, they should match (ie if you change one tone pot to a new value, you should probably change both). I may be completely wrong here - and I personally scour ebay and wait for the correct parts to turn up!

The shaft length is 9/16ths of an inch. Probably counts as short shaft - after all the shaft only goes through the scratchplate

jules

  • *****
  • 3068
    • View Profile
Gibson pots
« Reply #8 on: April 20, 2007, 04:26:03 AM »
Gibson used a lot of different pots, and it is hard to see why sometimes, somtimes it looks almost as if they used pots at random.... this post has taken me a long time to write - looking up data here and trying to formulate some kind of reason. As I always say with Gibson, the exception is the rule!

I am making the assumption that a certain pot with unique part number will not change taper characteristsics. (lets at least hope for that)

Gibson used a taper they described as 'special audio' which is not mentioned anywhere else - search google and see..... The volume pot 70028 is described as linear in some places, and as 'special audio' in others. Are they one and the same? It would explain some of the confusion, especially in in documentation they shortened 'special audio' to just 'audio'!!!!!!!!!!!!

This is the volume pot for (some) mid seventies rippers. In this ripper schematic it looks like it implies that 70028 is audio - just to confuse us more

My early (74) ripper had part 70027 for the volume pot, which has an unknown taper just now.....

This 78 ripper, has a '75 volume pot, with 70031 300K audio volume as described in the 1981 parts list

More generally, the change from audio to linear volumes was not absolute. Whilst the 1977 parts list shows the Ripper and L-6S as having 70028 300K linear, the grabber has two (one tone, one vol) 250K audio taper, and the marauder, G3 and S1 all have 70031 300K audio volume and 70035 100K audio tone. The majority of basses in that list still use 70027, with no specific mention of taper.

The Grabber and G-3 still have audio volumes according to the '81 list, and the ripper still has the audio!

Dave W

  • ****
  • 433
    • View Profile
pots for a ripper
« Reply #9 on: April 20, 2007, 05:28:29 PM »
Jules, I wish I knew the answer. It could be confusion in the descriptions, or it could be that there have been different 300K types used. It's certainly possible that whoever ordered the parts from the manufacturer(s) didn't always specify.

I do know that if you order the current Gibson volume pot, you get a 300K linear taper pot, and it has been that way for a long time. Beyond that, it's a mystery to me.

pots for a ripper
« Reply #10 on: April 20, 2007, 10:41:43 PM »
Thanks for all the info you guys, I'm down to these for choices,

ProLine 250K Control Potentiometer,
Gibson 300K OHM Potentiometer Linear Taper/Short Shaft

I don't think I'm going to find a Gibson 250 so you think the proline would be good?  I know nothing about wiring so, and I want my new baby ripper to be perfect.

pots for a ripper
« Reply #11 on: April 20, 2007, 10:42:15 PM »
Thanks for all the info you guys, I'm down to these for choices,

ProLine 250K Control Potentiometer,
Gibson 300K OHM Potentiometer Linear Taper/Short Shaft

I don't think I'm going to find a Gibson 250 so you think the proline would be good?  The proline doesn't say audio taper in the description though, is that okay?  I know nothing about wiring so, and I want my new baby ripper to be perfect.

Dave W

  • ****
  • 433
    • View Profile
pots for a ripper
« Reply #12 on: April 21, 2007, 12:26:25 AM »
I'm not familiar with ProLine's product, they seem to be an importer of guitar goods, not an electronics manufacturer so I couldn't tell you anything about the quality.

The Fender 250K pots are made by CTS, the price is slightly higher but I know they're good quality for the price.

pots for a ripper
« Reply #13 on: April 21, 2007, 04:23:17 PM »
This fender, "Fender T/V 250K Potentiometer Solid Shaft?"
Do you know what the T/V stands for?  I found this one at musicians friend, think thats my best bet?

Dave W

  • ****
  • 433
    • View Profile
pots for a ripper
« Reply #14 on: April 21, 2007, 04:39:00 PM »
T/V just means suitable for tone or volume. That's the one I'd use if I needed a solid shaft (for slip-on knobs with a setscrew). But if you need a split shaft for press-on knobs,  here's the split-shaft version.

 

Recent posts on vintage guitar and bass

1970 Rosetti Epiphone guitar catalogScan of 1970 Epiphone guitar catalogue produced by Rosetti for the UK market. Undated but most likely from mid-late 1970, this was the first UK catalogue to show the new range of Japanese (Matsumoku) Epiphone guitars. Interestingly, these pages show the Epiphone solid bodies with a single-sided Fender-style headstock layout - a feature quickly replaced with a typical two-sided Epiphone headstock almost immediately. Epiphone electric guitars: 9520, 9525; bass guitars: 9521, 9526; acoustic guitars: 6730, 6830, 6834
1971 A World of Guitars by Rosetti catalogueScan of 1971 Rosetti catalogue (UK) featuring guitars from from numerous manufacturers worldwide: guitars by Epiphone, Hagstrom, Levin, Hoyer, Egmond, Eros, Moridaira, Kiso-Suzuki, Schaller, and Tatra.
1971 Selmer guitar catalogueScan of 1971 Selmer guitar catalogue showing the range of electric and acoustic guitars distributed by the company: guitars by Gibson, Yamaha, Selmer, Hofner and Suzuki. 1960s Selmer had always placed Hofner at the front end of their catalogues, no doubt these were the better sellers - but into the 1970s Hofner were slipping somewhat and only appear at the tail end of this publication, pride of place going to Gibson, and to a lesser extent Yamaha. In fact this is the last Selmer catalogue to include the many Hofner hollow bodies (Committee, President, Senator etc) that had defined the companies output for so many years - to be replaced in the 1972 catalogue by generic solid body 'copies' of Gibson and Fender models. A number of new Gibson models are included for the first time: the SG-100 and SG-200 six string guitars and the SB-300 and SB-400 basses.
1968 Selmer guitar catalogueScan of 1968/1969 Selmer guitar catalogue (printed July 1968), showing the entire range of electric and acoustic guitars distributed by the company: guitars by Hofner, Gibson, Selmer and Giannini. Selmer were the exclusive United Kingdom distributors of Hofner and Gibson at the time, and this catalogue contains a total of 18 electric guitars, 7 bass guitars, 37 acoustics, and 2 Hawaiian guitars - all produced outside the UK and imported by Selmer, with UK prices included in guineas. This catalogue saw the (re-)introduction of the late sixties Gibson Les Paul Custom and Les Paul Standard (see page 69) and the short-lived Hofner Club 70. Other electric models include: HOFNER ELECTRICS: Committee, Verithin 66, Ambassador, President, Senator, Galaxie, HOFNER BASSES: Violin bass, Verithin bass, Senator bass, Professional bass GIBSON ELECTRICS: Barney Kessel, ES-330TD, ES-335TD, ES-345TD, ES-175D, ES-125CD, SG Standard, SG Junior, SG Special GIBSON BASSES: EB-0, EB-2, EB-3 - plus a LOT of acoustics branded Gibson, Hofner, Selmer and Giannini
1961 Hofner Colorama IHofner Colorama was the name UK distributor Selmer gave to a series of solid and semi-solid guitars built by Hofner for distribution in the UK. The construction and specifications of the guitars varied over the period of production, but by 1961 it was a totally solid, double cutaway instrument, with a set neck, translucent cherry finish, six-in-a-row headstock, and Hofner Diamond logo pickups. Available as a single or dual pickup guitar, this sngle pickup version would have been sold in mainland Europe as the Hofner 161.
1971 Commodore N25 (Matsumoku)Commodore was a brand applied to a series of guitars produced in Japan at the well-respected Matsumoku plant from the late 1960s to the mid 1970s - and sold primarily (perhaps exclusively?) in the United Kingdom. The models bearing the Commodore name were all guitars available from different distributors with different branding. Although there may have been some minor changes in appointments (specifically headstock branding) most had the same basic bodies, hardware and construction. Equivalent models to the Commodore N25 (and this is by no means an exhaustive list) include the Aria 5102T, Conrad 5102T(?), Electra 2221, Lyle 5102T, Ventura V-1001, Univox Coily - and most famously the Epiphone 5102T / Epiphone EA-250.
1960 Hofner Colorama IIThe Hofner Colorama was the name given by Selmer to a series of solid (and semi-solid) body Hofner guitars distributed in the United Kingdom between 1958 and 1965. The Colorama name actually applied to some quite different guitars over the period, but in 1960 it was a very light, semi-solid, set necked guitar with one (Colorama I) or two (Colorama II, as seen here) Toaster pickups. Although an entry-level guitar, it was very well-built, and a fine playing guitar; certainly a step up (at least in terms of craftsmanship) from many of the Colorama guitars that would follow, and a good deal of the guitars available in Britain circa 1960.
1971 Epiphone 1820 (ET-280) bassBy the end of the 1960s, a decision had been made to move Epiphone guitar production from the USA (at the Kalamazoo plant where Gibson guitars were made), to Matsumoto in Japan, creating a line of guitars and basses significantly less expensive than the USA-built models (actually less than half the price). The Matsumoku factory had been producing guitars for export for some time, but the 1820 bass (alongside a number of guitar models and the 5120 electric acoustic bass) were the first Epiphone models to be made there. These new Epiphones were based on existing Matsumoku guitars, sharing body shapes, and hardware, but the Epiphone line was somewhat upgraded, with inlaid logos and a 2x2 peghead configuration. Over the course of the 70s, the Japanese output improved dramatically, and in many ways these early 70s models are a low point for the brand. Having said this, there are a lot worse guitars out there, and as well as being historically important, the 1820 bass can certainly provide the goods when required.
1981 Gibson MarauderProduction of Bill Lawrence's Gibson Marauder began in 1974, with production peaking in 1978. But by 1980 the model was officially discontinued, though very small numbers slipped out as late as spring 1981. Over 7000 examples shipped between 1974 and 1979, and although no totals are available for 1980 and 1981, it is unlikely production reached three figures in either of these years. These final Marauders were all assembled at the Gibson Nashville plant, and had some nice features not available through the later years of production, such as a rosewood fretboard, and in this case, an opaque 'Devil Red' finish. It's a great looking and fine playing guitar!