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Gibson Ripper/EB-3 Bass Mid Tone Control

Gibson Ripper/EB-3 Bass Mid Tone Control
« on: October 04, 2006, 10:48:16 PM »
I am looking for a place to buy or know of anyone with extra ripper electronics that is willing to sell the mid tone pot with the tone choke.  I  find the mid tone cut really warms up my Ripper bass and I want to try to wire one on my other bass but I'm having a really hard time finding the choke.  For those that don't know, the choke is the about 2-inch long coil usualy sodered on back of the pot.  It looks like two small spools with a bolt joining them.  Looking at schematics, Gibson also used them on the mid-seventies EB-3 and EB-3L, Howard Roberts guitar and I believe it is very similar to that used in the old varitone dials.  Anyone have an old Gibson choke or have a disfunctional Ripper that would like to sell the electronics?

Gibson Ripper/EB-3 Bass Mid Tone Control
« Reply #1 on: October 05, 2006, 05:19:38 PM »
There is no such thing as a mid tone pot on a Gibson bass - are you talking about the rotary switch with the chickenhead knob (the varitone)?

What you call the choke is actually an inductor coil - the Ripper's choke consists of this inductor AND a capacitor and is not a mid boost so much as a bass and treble cut (a 1st order low pass filter in series with a 1st order high pass filter).

The (Series 1) EB3 choke is a completely differant animal - it is a 2nd order High pass filter - and more importantly the inductor coil has a differant value (as well as a differant part #) than the Ripper.  The  Series 2 EB3 has a very similar choke circuit to the Ripper; the inductor is the same but the cap is differant.  

It is Highly unlikely that you will find the Ripper choke coil (Gibson part # 70-442) for sale on it's own - you will have to cannabalize it from another bass (remember that only a Series 2 EB3 has the correct inductor for your purposes, that's any EB3 after the slothead period, 1971 and later).  The biggest annoyance, I find, is that an inductor of the same value (actually it's 2 inductors, reverse wound, in series, so as to be hum cancelling - not pictured as such in the Ripper  diagram, but it is on the Series 2 EB3 diagram, and looking at the actual part it becomes obvious) could easily be found - IF WE KNEW WHAT THE VALUE OF THE INDUCTOR WAS that is.  We have the value of the Series 1 EB3 inductor (Gibson Part # GA-90) because it is the same part used in the EB2 choke and the EB2 diagram has the value labeled.  

If you, or a friend, have the equipment to test the value of the inductor coil in your Ripper than you could just go down to any electronic part supply store and buy the equivalent value inductor (it wouldn't be humbucking like the original part; you could buy 2 inductors of half the required value each and tinker but I doubt it's worth it).

Most likely you do not have such means - I would recomend you experiment with a few values for the inductor (they're cheap, a couple cents each) and see what you like best.  

Easier still try the Big D varitone switch (google it or wait for Redbird to drop by and provide the link) - it is a prewired multi-preset tone control.  At least one of the settings is much like the Ripper choke, IIRC. You just wire the thing in series with the hot lead just before the output jack - easy as pie.

doom

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Gibson Ripper/EB-3 Bass Mid Tone Control
« Reply #2 on: October 05, 2006, 08:53:54 PM »
Quote
There is no such thing as a mid tone pot on a Gibson bass - are you talking about the rotary switch with the chickenhead knob (the varitone)?

What you call the choke is actually an inductor coil - the Ripper's choke consists of this inductor AND a capacitor and is not a mid boost so much as a bass and treble cut (a 1st order low pass filter in series with a 1st order high pass filter).


Jake, there is a mid tone control on the Ripper along with a treble tone control. You're right, technically there is no boosting involved but you control the mid notch filter with the potentiometer. Gibson refers to it as a midrange roll-off control.

Gibson Ripper/EB-3 Bass Mid Tone Control
« Reply #3 on: October 05, 2006, 10:19:36 PM »
Really - lemme look at a circuit diagram - I don't actually own a Ripper and always assumed it was a V T T or V V T setup. ...  Right you are; I tip my hat and appologise. I guess I better learn to not shoot my mouth off like that  :roll:

Gibson Ripper/EB-3 Bass Mid Tone Control
« Reply #4 on: October 05, 2006, 11:31:06 PM »
Quote from: Granny Gremlin
There is no such thing as a mid tone pot on a Gibson bass - are you talking about the rotary switch with the chickenhead knob (the varitone)?

What you call the choke is actually an inductor coil - the Ripper's choke consists of this inductor AND a capacitor and is not a mid boost so much as a bass and treble cut (a 1st order low pass filter in series with a 1st order high pass filter).

The (Series 1) EB3 choke is a completely differant animal - it is a 2nd order High pass filter - and more importantly the inductor coil has a differant value (as well as a differant part #) than the Ripper.  The  Series 2 EB3 has a very similar choke circuit to the Ripper; the inductor is the same but the cap is differant.  

It is Highly unlikely that you will find the Ripper choke coil (Gibson part # 70-442) for sale on it's own - you will have to cannabalize it from another bass (remember that only a Series 2 EB3 has the correct inductor for your purposes, that's any EB3 after the slothead period, 1971 and later).  The biggest annoyance, I find, is that an inductor of the same value (actually it's 2 inductors, reverse wound, in series, so as to be hum cancelling - not pictured as such in the Ripper  diagram, but it is on the Series 2 EB3 diagram, and looking at the actual part it becomes obvious) could easily be found - IF WE KNEW WHAT THE VALUE OF THE INDUCTOR WAS that is.  We have the value of the Series 1 EB3 inductor (Gibson Part # GA-90) because it is the same part used in the EB2 choke and the EB2 diagram has the value labeled.  

If you, or a friend, have the equipment to test the value of the inductor coil in your Ripper than you could just go down to any electronic part supply store and buy the equivalent value inductor (it wouldn't be humbucking like the original part; you could buy 2 inductors of half the required value each and tinker but I doubt it's worth it).

Most likely you do not have such means - I would recomend you experiment with a few values for the inductor (they're cheap, a couple cents each) and see what you like best.  

Easier still try the Big D varitone switch (google it or wait for Redbird to drop by and provide the link) - it is a prewired multi-preset tone control.  At least one of the settings is much like the Ripper choke, IIRC. You just wire the thing in series with the hot lead just before the output jack - easy as pie.
  "Preach" that "Gibson-Gospel" brother..."Preach"! :P

Re: Gibson Ripper/EB-3 Bass Mid Tone Control
« Reply #5 on: October 06, 2006, 12:14:57 AM »
Quote from: bolmsted
the choke is the about 2-inch long coil usualy sodered on back of the pot.  It looks like two small spools with a bolt joining them.


In this link there's a picture of the electronics of my Ripper. You can see the "choke" clearly.

http://www.decoda.net/FCBASS/index_best ... etails.htm

Good luck and Cheers!

F.C.
www.fcbass.com
Damaged Justice

"Stop wasting my time
You know what I want
You know what I need
Or maybe you don\'t
Do I have to come right flat out and tell you everything?"

doom

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Gibson Ripper/EB-3 Bass Mid Tone Control
« Reply #6 on: October 06, 2006, 07:38:53 AM »
Did someone mention Big D:http://www.bigdguitars.com/

Gibson Ripper/EB-3 Bass Mid Tone Control
« Reply #7 on: October 15, 2006, 03:22:02 PM »
check out HAS Sound.com, they have a lot of interesting tone/mid/bass/vari tone controls.

Gibson Ripper/EB-3 Bass Mid Tone Control
« Reply #8 on: October 16, 2006, 06:02:00 PM »
whaddayamean - project schematics or actual parts for sale?

Also, please repost a link or active address - I can't find the site with the info provided.

Gibson Ripper/EB-3 Bass Mid Tone Control
« Reply #9 on: October 22, 2006, 06:12:38 PM »
Has-sound.com     Guitar wiring, electronics and control upgrades, tone kits, parts and accessories. ... Home / Passive Electronics. Custom Wiring Harnesses. Pickups.

Gibson Ripper/EB-3 Bass Mid Tone Control
« Reply #10 on: October 23, 2006, 02:55:26 AM »
So I purchased the bass mid tone control from HAS and one from Gremling Engineering.  They both are basically the same and no where near the sound of the original Ripper mid control.  I compared both new tone controls with a regular tone control and it is an extremely slight differnce.  The HAS uses a small inductor and a 0.1uF cap, the inductor is probably on the scale of microhenries based on the size.  The Ripper mid tone uses a 0.1uF cap and two much bigger inductors hooked in series.  After research, the reason the HAS mid tone sounds almost the same as a regular tone control is becasue the small inductor the HAS uses does very little to roll off the lows and the resulting overall sound is essentially a fancy regular tone control that just rolls the highs.  I found an equation to calculate the inductor needed to create a mid cut at 500 Hz and the inductor needs to be 1.0 henries!!!  I assume the Rippers inductor is somewhere close to this based on the size and sound.  Don't bother with the HAS or Gremling mid tone, they do nothing for the mids.

I'm still looking for an original Ripper coke, if any one has one and is willing to sell, let me know, I'd like to buy one.

Gibson Ripper/EB-3 Bass Mid Tone Control
« Reply #11 on: October 23, 2006, 03:44:28 AM »
I just sent  HAS an email about their mid-tone control. I will let you know what they reply.

Gibson Ripper/EB-3 Bass Mid Tone Control
« Reply #12 on: October 23, 2006, 06:38:56 PM »
Quote from: bolmsted
I found an equation to calculate the inductor needed to create a mid cut at 500 Hz and the inductor needs to be 1.0 henries!!!  I assume the Rippers inductor is somewhere close to this based on the size and sound.  


What was the equation?  

If you are reasonably sure that you've calculated the right value, just go out and buy yourself a good quality inductor of that value - it'll be MUCH cheaper than the real thing.  If you want it to be humbucking like the original then buy 2 of half the value and unwind/rewind one of them backwards then hook them in series - it'll be the same thing.

Gibson Ripper/EB-3 Bass Mid Tone Control
« Reply #13 on: October 24, 2006, 01:07:00 AM »
here is the reply from HAS: It is impossible for me to compare my mid-cut with the original Gibson without one in hand. Yes, mine uses a .1 cap. As for the choke, my information indicates that Gibson used a 1.5 henry, the same value as the one I use.

maybe!!choke
« Reply #14 on: October 25, 2006, 12:59:37 PM »
I have some parts for  rippers at home . I have a bastardized blond that I am going to convert to a fretless sunburst. some genius routed the body to add a 3 rd pup and used wood grain formica to make a pickguard. . the fret board is as flat as  flat can be so that has to go . Otherwise it is in good shape. I need another ripper pup so Im in limbo,however I have 2 old ripper pick guards with various parts. There are two chokes  and I only need one . If you give me an idea how to test them, Id sell one. If I just sell one ,Ill probably  end up with the one that is broken :roll: There are pots and pointers that are well aged and I think one has the 4 position switch. Im not a hoarder  like some of  collectors of chrome etc.You know who u R!Let me know,M

 

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