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EB3 tone choke removal

doom

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EB3 tone choke removal
« Reply #15 on: July 30, 2008, 10:01:24 PM »
I'm no expert either but if barend has the experience of a difference I guess that would be the explanation. I would'nt think it had that much effect but when I come to think of it Rickenbacker used (appearently back now with push/pull pot) a cap in series from the bridge pickup and value was .0047. The value determines the cut off frequensy and the higher the value the higher cut off point if I'm not mistaken. Gibson used a .0200 cap so a lot of the low end is filtered. OTOH the resistor is "only" 220 Ohms so you'd think most of the fullrange signal would pass through it. I don't know but it seems like it does not.

I'm still thinking of modding my '69 EB-3 (including reversing the vol pots) but I'm hesitating since the electronics are untouched. I have this mod in mind I came up with during a previous thread. This one:http://forums.vintageguitarandbass.com/showthread.php?1521-EB3-tone-choke-removal



The idea is:

Pos 1: Full Mudbucker only.
Pos 2: Full Mudbucker + bridge pickup.
Pos 3: Mudbucker and high pass (like barends pos 4) + Bridge pickup.
Pos 4: Like pos 3 but coil engaged (ie like original pos 3).

If I mod the pots I can use the bridge pup solo if I want (but I never have).

barend

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EB3 tone choke removal
« Reply #16 on: July 30, 2008, 10:09:42 PM »
Quote from: chromium
Barend- the way it is right now, does your bass sound the same on position 1 and position 4?  That is what I would have expected from the change you made of removing the green wire.  I'd expect pos 1 to now sound less muffled, and pos 4 to now have more low end and low mids - and both positions should sound almost exactly the same.


yes that is exactly how it is right now. Position 1 and 4 sound exactly the same. I also think position has more lows now but not less muffled. Because of the more lows it sounds more muddy. But I am sure because now I don't remember how it was. I might hear things which are not there.

Quote from: chromium
BTW- I like that trick with the volume controls too.  I wish I would have known that when I rewired my EB-2D with the choke bybass!


Doom: can you describe exactly how you should do this volume controls mod? as I said I don't know much about electronics. But I have to explain it to my guitar tech/luthier so he knows what to do. And does this change have any effect on the sound?

doom

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EB3 tone choke removal
« Reply #17 on: July 31, 2008, 09:49:03 AM »
Quote from: barend

Doom: can you describe exactly how you should do this volume controls mod? as I said I don't know much about electronics. But I have to explain it to my guitar tech/luthier so he knows what to do. And does this change have any effect on the sound?


Switch places of the wires I marked with red.


barend

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EB3 tone choke removal
« Reply #18 on: July 31, 2008, 10:13:51 AM »
Hey doom, thanks a lot, great help!

so no change in tone or overall volume, just more control over your pickup volumes?

doom

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EB3 tone choke removal
« Reply #19 on: July 31, 2008, 11:54:09 AM »
Quote from: barend
Hey doom, thanks a lot, great help!

so no change in tone or overall volume, just more control over your pickup volumes?


Correct! Individual control over each pickup. Nothing else.

513

EB3 tone choke removal
« Reply #20 on: August 07, 2011, 02:59:29 PM »
Quote from: doom;8978
Switch places of the wires I marked with red.


Hi, I ended up reading this thread, after a search for some information on the tone choke on EB3's. Reason: an old Ibanez EB3 body, that was bought without electronics, I used it to check some rewound old Italian hollowbody pickups on.
I've been restoring another Italian hollowbody for those, this would have left me with an EB3 copy without electronics again. So I've bought replacement EB pickups to keep the Ibanez playable.

After digging through publications about Gibson wiring, and previous wiring jobs, I thought it might come in handy to show you some of my conclusions.

This is how I'm going to wire up the Ibanez, without choke (because they are hardly available and can be replaced by an equalizer pedal).




Another thing I noticed is that the tone circuitry varies, depending on the age  of the bass, the variations that I've noticed are in the pic above.
Note: at 2, 3, 4, 5 & 6 the capacitor connection can also be made at the middle pole of the volume pot.
« Last Edit: August 07, 2011, 06:05:43 PM by 513 »

EB3 Toggle Switch
« Reply #21 on: December 09, 2011, 12:32:34 AM »
Well, after reading different posts for the last 2 hours, I have decided that it is my EB3 that has been blowing my bass speakers, and that I need to probably double-check the wiring.
 
I bought my bass with no varitone switch or choke, but it has a 3-position toggle switch in place of it. From what I have read, this is not an uncommon mod. Where can I find the correct way to rewire the harness when using the toggle switch? Is the diagram below the correct one for a '69 EB3?
 
Right now the controls don't make sense to me, the volumes change tone settings and it's all hard to control. I need to be able to better control the neck pick-up and I would like to be able to tune-in a more "speaker friendly" pick-up combination and tone.

jules

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Gibson EB3 speaker damage
« Reply #22 on: December 09, 2011, 01:19:49 PM »
Quote from: cimchazz1;16598
I have decided that it is my EB3 that has been blowing my bass speakers, and that I need to probably double-check the wiring

I've damaged speakers in the past with my EB3s. And although I can not be 100% sure, I would say that it is just the extreme vibrations caused by this bass, especially the neck humbucker, that can shake apart the least sturdy cones.
 
So, going from a three way switch to a varitone won't stop this. You just need a lot more headroom on your amp. With an EB3, I try never to much above 50% volume - especially when using the mega-bass setting.
 
Also make sure the neck pickup is not too high - reduce the signal a bit if you can.
 
As for rewiring - it might be best to get a loom with choke attached from ebay - they do come up every month or so
 
Or do you have a choke already?

EB3 tone choke removal
« Reply #23 on: May 23, 2012, 11:39:22 PM »
Quote from: jules;16599
I've damaged speakers in the past with my EB3s. And although I can not be 100% sure, I would say that it is just the extreme vibrations caused by this bass, especially the neck humbucker, that can shake apart the least sturdy cones.
 
So, going from a three way switch to a varitone won't stop this. You just need a lot more headroom on your amp. With an EB3, I try never to much above 50% volume - especially when using the mega-bass setting.
 
Also make sure the neck pickup is not too high - reduce the signal a bit if you can.
 
As for rewiring - it might be best to get a loom with choke attached from ebay - they do come up every month or so
 
Or do you have a choke already?


No, I don't have a choke yet. But I am ordering an inductor from Mouser soon. Actually, my EB3 drives the preamps into clipping on both my GK amps, but it seems to be fine playing through tube amps, of course. That neck pickup is pretty hot. Maybe I need to try some rewiring possibly to tone it down some and get some better tone out of it? Other than that, great bass!!
« Last Edit: May 23, 2012, 11:47:53 PM by cimchazz1 »

EB3 tone choke removal
« Reply #24 on: June 29, 2012, 01:55:04 AM »
Thanks Jules, I did finally buy a '69 EB3 harness off EBay with a choke, but it has one strange 250k pot (which I can swap to 500k). So, after all these wiring suggestions and posts, what is the best way to set this bass up so it sounds good and I can play it through my GK1001 without clipping the preamp and blowing more speakers? (I do have a "-14db PAD" switch on this amp to cut the preamp signal if needed, too.)
I am not worried about keeping the wiring original if this makes it sound like crap on-stage, I intend to use this one. But it would be nice to take advantage of the choke I just bought, I'm guessing they must have put it there for a reason (or was it bad engineering) ? Thanks.

jules

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EB3 tone choke removal
« Reply #25 on: June 29, 2012, 12:39:10 PM »
Well to some extent you might need to experiment - I lilke the choke - it's perfect for some songs but no good at all for others -
the styles of music being played when they created this circuit in 1961 were quite different, so I don't think you can call it bad engineering - they were just trying to make a small solidbody sound like an upright. As you know it doesn't really sound like an upright, it is it's own sound.

As a first move i'd put in the stock circuitry and see what you think - don't deceide too quickly because you might find tones that sound great at home don't quite sound so good played out or vice versa. I find the bridge pickup a little too thin at home, but perfect played out through a bigger amp. The choked neck can often be too overpowering at home, you really feel the bass - but then doesn't cut through well when recorded

EB3 tone choke removal
« Reply #26 on: June 30, 2012, 01:44:24 AM »
Ok, thanks, that sounds good to me. The GK amp I'm using may help the tone, too, and I will use the -14db PAD button on the pre-amp to keep from clipping it and frying speakers. I bet this guitar sounds good stock thru the old 400PS I have, that's probably what it's for. This will be tonight's project, thanks.

EB3 tone choke removal
« Reply #27 on: June 30, 2012, 05:10:32 PM »
The original harness is back in place and working. But about the chicken head knob, did the originals have a screw in the back? Does anyone know where I can find the correct one? I have a few but have the brass smooth insert inside with a retaining screw and I don't want to use them and ruin the shaft on the switch.

EB3 tone choke removal
« Reply #28 on: July 10, 2012, 01:09:06 AM »
Well, it seems nobody had a good resource for these, but I found some great chicken head knobs. They have the correct knurl inside, no screws, and they say DAKAWARE and CHICAGO on the bottom, and the one I put on fit perfectly!!!!!

 

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