Vintage Guitar and Bass forum

Modifying and breaking "rules"

Modifying and breaking "rules"
« on: April 14, 2007, 06:41:51 PM »
I like variety and I enjoy trying new things and breaking the sage old "rules" for myself.   It can be costly or can be a breakthrough.  I think every bass should have EMGs in a P configuration, but that is taboo to many.  I like to wire my tone knobs "wide open" and not use them cuz I am always accidentally changing them.   It makes my basses louder too.  I played a GK head for years through 2 cabs with different ohms and it sounded "hot" and live and everyone loved my spongy Steve Harris sound.  Til one day it finally caught on fire.  God I miss that rig, but it helps to match the amp and speakers.   Fenderbirds, projects, all that stuff.  Love hearing the tales and seeing the pics!

Modifying and breaking "rules"
« Reply #1 on: April 16, 2007, 12:55:59 PM »
i also like custom/moded basses.why use the same gear as everybody else?i have to disagree with you on both et EMG's(i hate 'em)and tone knobs(i use it all the time)i try to look for beater basses to mod,i wouldn't mess with a all original vintage instrument.with Gibsons,there is no shortage of project basses out there.
ROCK-N-ROLL PIRATE...SKATE PUNK. 72 SB450, 76 RIPPER, 77 G3 GRABBER,92 LPB-1, 75 P-BASS,78 T-40,RAT FUZZ & BAD ATTITUDE

eb2

  • ****
  • 456
    • View Profile
Modifying and breaking "rules"
« Reply #2 on: April 17, 2007, 08:29:03 AM »
I have no problem with any mod to electronics that can be reversed.  Meaning that if you go to sell it, or drop dead and your wife sells it, then the new owner hasn't got some permanent scar courtesy of you.  Hot rod wiring and pup swapping is tons of fun and if done correctly harmless.  As far as the tone knobs "wired" open - isn't that just removing them from the circuit?  In which case, that is cool as the knobs are still there and someone can solder the two contacts back anytime.

I cringe when I find some dingbat has decided to take an old perfectly fine instrument and do some goofy mod like putting a Pbass pup somewhere on the body, using a screwdriver to chisel the hole.  Or convert a 50s P into a 5 string.  Or take an early single pup ES175 and stick a DiMarzio SuperDistortion humbucker at the bridge.  Or take the dozens of old Strats and drill out the neck and body for Floyd Rose junk.  I think I have seen it all.  And 25 years ago when you could score an old quality guitar or bass at a flea market for peanuts, I could see some of that.  But even then I thought it was nuts.  Nowadays, with prices for stuff through the roof, you have to really take stock of what you are doing and the negative effect of taking away wood and factory finish.
boom

jules

  • *****
  • 3068
    • View Profile
mods
« Reply #3 on: April 19, 2007, 03:11:00 PM »
Quote from: eb2
I cringe when I find some dingbat has decided to take an old perfectly fine instrument and do some goofy mod like putting a Pbass pup somewhere on the body, using a screwdriver to chisel the hole.  Or convert a 50s P into a 5 string.  Or take an early single pup ES175 and stick a DiMarzio SuperDistortion humbucker at the bridge.  Or take the dozens of old Strats and drill out the neck and body for Floyd Rose junk.  I think I have seen it all.


However if you find one like this, you have free reign to go nuts on it. Hacked guitars go for small prices - and they will never get their value back, so why not use these ones foe crazy projects. I've got a hacked refinned ripper just waiting for some EB humbuckers.

Re-modding is cheaper, and better in the long run!

Modifying and breaking "rules"
« Reply #4 on: April 21, 2007, 02:34:33 AM »
did you get that one w/ the ebony board?are you gonna go twice mud?     i put some guild JSII pups i my ripper.sounds great,and black & chrome looks awesome.
ROCK-N-ROLL PIRATE...SKATE PUNK. 72 SB450, 76 RIPPER, 77 G3 GRABBER,92 LPB-1, 75 P-BASS,78 T-40,RAT FUZZ & BAD ATTITUDE

jules

  • *****
  • 3068
    • View Profile
Modifying and breaking "rules"
« Reply #5 on: April 21, 2007, 02:35:49 PM »
Quote from: reaper attack
did you get that one w/ the ebony board?are you gonna go twice mud?     i put some guild JSII pups i my ripper.sounds great,and black & chrome looks awesome.


no its natural, (maple board) and its been hanging around my 'pile' for years. It will be double humbucker - even though this has less tonal varition than I like. I found the mudbucker at the bridge to be not that different from the one at the neck. I may try other combinations over time. I would like to put something different at the bridge, but hide it under the mudbucker cover - because I just like that look. I wonder whether some creative wiring could be employed to make a wider variation in sounds.

I wonder whether someone could rewind a mudbucker and add in a coil tap switch or something - same hardware but very different sound. hmmmm

I mention it in a forum post every six months - always meaning to get it done but never quite getting there - loosely copying this bass
but with some differences

I've got all the parts - but the body is just sanded down and it needs a refin before I put it all together

The guild pups are good though - I have a JS1 and it sounds great. I bet they would be good in a ripper too

Modifying and breaking "rules"
« Reply #6 on: April 23, 2007, 03:01:20 AM »
those pups are great.my ripper is alder,so they darken up the bright sound a bit.but not mud.do you have the pups your gonna use?
ROCK-N-ROLL PIRATE...SKATE PUNK. 72 SB450, 76 RIPPER, 77 G3 GRABBER,92 LPB-1, 75 P-BASS,78 T-40,RAT FUZZ & BAD ATTITUDE

Modifying and breaking "rules"
« Reply #7 on: April 25, 2007, 02:48:06 AM »
CHROME!
ROCK-N-ROLL PIRATE...SKATE PUNK. 72 SB450, 76 RIPPER, 77 G3 GRABBER,92 LPB-1, 75 P-BASS,78 T-40,RAT FUZZ & BAD ATTITUDE

jules

  • *****
  • 3068
    • View Profile
pups
« Reply #8 on: April 25, 2007, 01:41:58 PM »
Quote from: reaper attack
do you have the pups your gonna use?


I think so. I've got some mudbuckers put aside, but I may experiment with other things too. I've got an EB4L pickup aswell which might work better at the bridge. Just depends how tricky the wiring will get - varitones are not my strongpoint, but i'm learning!

Modifying and breaking "rules"
« Reply #9 on: April 26, 2007, 12:52:40 AM »
whats the deal withthose eb4 super humbuckers?
ROCK-N-ROLL PIRATE...SKATE PUNK. 72 SB450, 76 RIPPER, 77 G3 GRABBER,92 LPB-1, 75 P-BASS,78 T-40,RAT FUZZ & BAD ATTITUDE

jules

  • *****
  • 3068
    • View Profile
EB4L humbucker
« Reply #10 on: April 26, 2007, 03:24:37 PM »
Quote from: reaper attack
whats the deal withthose eb4 super humbuckers?

You can see the inside of an EB4L humbucker here
https://www.flyguitars.com/gibson/bass/parts/pickup/EB4Lhumbucker3.php

As you can see it is quite different to a normal humbucker - and allows you various options. You could probably arrange more options than those standard on the EB4L - which may or may not be useful.... I'll have to try and see what sounds good in the bridge position of a ripper

Modifying and breaking "rules"
« Reply #11 on: May 22, 2007, 02:38:06 AM »
hey eb2,do you really care about the next man?
ROCK-N-ROLL PIRATE...SKATE PUNK. 72 SB450, 76 RIPPER, 77 G3 GRABBER,92 LPB-1, 75 P-BASS,78 T-40,RAT FUZZ & BAD ATTITUDE

GEO

Frankenstein basses - just do it
« Reply #12 on: April 15, 2008, 10:37:14 PM »
This is a big issue topic isn't it?  One can stand on either bank and shout across the river how it must be this way or the other, but like all things black & white, it leaves out some pretty vibrant currents in the middle.  I feel that with the ever increasing advent of accessible after-market 'this and that's' out there it blows the doors open for unique hybrids.  As far as history goes there already has been precedents set. Fender-birds, P-basses w/Jazz necks, or the other way around, PJ pup combo's, mod this and that and the other, it's nothing new.  Wasn't the 70's Tele bass more or less a production hybrid?  What about an open D extension machine on a valuable concert double bass?  An instrument should be an extension of the player, and sometimes (one hopes) like the players themselves, things evolve.  As long as the owner/player plays the whatever it turns into, and is a better/happier player because of it, are you going to tell me that isn't "right"?  Should Jaco never have "butchered" his fingerboard making it fret-less using a butter knife?  I respect and understand the "collectable" value of instruments to a certain degree, and would also cringe if I saw a particular hack-job, but I also take offense to see a vintage instrument looked at purely as an investment.  I hate what's happened to electric basses/guitars from the 50's/60's.  Untouchable to all but money people.  I own a vintage bass, bought it long before it was "collectable", and I play it.  It was made for that purpose and I intend to keep playing it with no more than a curious interest in it's current or future monetary worth.  I know it's worth to me, and that's where it ends.  I also have modified it myself, many years ago, and never to this day regret doing so.  I won't specify what instrument it is or how it was modified because I do not request anyones opinion related to my reasoning.  Everyone has their own opinion, and everyone has a right to it.  No side taken here other than not taking one.  "Bottom" line: Whatever your bass is worth in the "marketplace", if you own them - play them, that's why they exist.  F**K the Hard Rock Cafe mentality.

 

Recent posts on vintage guitar and bass

1970 Rosetti Epiphone guitar catalogScan of 1970 Epiphone guitar catalogue produced by Rosetti for the UK market. Undated but most likely from mid-late 1970, this was the first UK catalogue to show the new range of Japanese (Matsumoku) Epiphone guitars. Interestingly, these pages show the Epiphone solid bodies with a single-sided Fender-style headstock layout - a feature quickly replaced with a typical two-sided Epiphone headstock almost immediately. Epiphone electric guitars: 9520, 9525; bass guitars: 9521, 9526; acoustic guitars: 6730, 6830, 6834
1971 A World of Guitars by Rosetti catalogueScan of 1971 Rosetti catalogue (UK) featuring guitars from from numerous manufacturers worldwide: guitars by Epiphone, Hagstrom, Levin, Hoyer, Egmond, Eros, Moridaira, Kiso-Suzuki, Schaller, and Tatra.
1971 Selmer guitar catalogueScan of 1971 Selmer guitar catalogue showing the range of electric and acoustic guitars distributed by the company: guitars by Gibson, Yamaha, Selmer, Hofner and Suzuki. 1960s Selmer had always placed Hofner at the front end of their catalogues, no doubt these were the better sellers - but into the 1970s Hofner were slipping somewhat and only appear at the tail end of this publication, pride of place going to Gibson, and to a lesser extent Yamaha. In fact this is the last Selmer catalogue to include the many Hofner hollow bodies (Committee, President, Senator etc) that had defined the companies output for so many years - to be replaced in the 1972 catalogue by generic solid body 'copies' of Gibson and Fender models. A number of new Gibson models are included for the first time: the SG-100 and SG-200 six string guitars and the SB-300 and SB-400 basses.
1968 Selmer guitar catalogueScan of 1968/1969 Selmer guitar catalogue (printed July 1968), showing the entire range of electric and acoustic guitars distributed by the company: guitars by Hofner, Gibson, Selmer and Giannini. Selmer were the exclusive United Kingdom distributors of Hofner and Gibson at the time, and this catalogue contains a total of 18 electric guitars, 7 bass guitars, 37 acoustics, and 2 Hawaiian guitars - all produced outside the UK and imported by Selmer, with UK prices included in guineas. This catalogue saw the (re-)introduction of the late sixties Gibson Les Paul Custom and Les Paul Standard (see page 69) and the short-lived Hofner Club 70. Other electric models include: HOFNER ELECTRICS: Committee, Verithin 66, Ambassador, President, Senator, Galaxie, HOFNER BASSES: Violin bass, Verithin bass, Senator bass, Professional bass GIBSON ELECTRICS: Barney Kessel, ES-330TD, ES-335TD, ES-345TD, ES-175D, ES-125CD, SG Standard, SG Junior, SG Special GIBSON BASSES: EB-0, EB-2, EB-3 - plus a LOT of acoustics branded Gibson, Hofner, Selmer and Giannini
1961 Hofner Colorama IHofner Colorama was the name UK distributor Selmer gave to a series of solid and semi-solid guitars built by Hofner for distribution in the UK. The construction and specifications of the guitars varied over the period of production, but by 1961 it was a totally solid, double cutaway instrument, with a set neck, translucent cherry finish, six-in-a-row headstock, and Hofner Diamond logo pickups. Available as a single or dual pickup guitar, this sngle pickup version would have been sold in mainland Europe as the Hofner 161.
1971 Commodore N25 (Matsumoku)Commodore was a brand applied to a series of guitars produced in Japan at the well-respected Matsumoku plant from the late 1960s to the mid 1970s - and sold primarily (perhaps exclusively?) in the United Kingdom. The models bearing the Commodore name were all guitars available from different distributors with different branding. Although there may have been some minor changes in appointments (specifically headstock branding) most had the same basic bodies, hardware and construction. Equivalent models to the Commodore N25 (and this is by no means an exhaustive list) include the Aria 5102T, Conrad 5102T(?), Electra 2221, Lyle 5102T, Ventura V-1001, Univox Coily - and most famously the Epiphone 5102T / Epiphone EA-250.
1960 Hofner Colorama IIThe Hofner Colorama was the name given by Selmer to a series of solid (and semi-solid) body Hofner guitars distributed in the United Kingdom between 1958 and 1965. The Colorama name actually applied to some quite different guitars over the period, but in 1960 it was a very light, semi-solid, set necked guitar with one (Colorama I) or two (Colorama II, as seen here) Toaster pickups. Although an entry-level guitar, it was very well-built, and a fine playing guitar; certainly a step up (at least in terms of craftsmanship) from many of the Colorama guitars that would follow, and a good deal of the guitars available in Britain circa 1960.
1971 Epiphone 1820 (ET-280) bassBy the end of the 1960s, a decision had been made to move Epiphone guitar production from the USA (at the Kalamazoo plant where Gibson guitars were made), to Matsumoto in Japan, creating a line of guitars and basses significantly less expensive than the USA-built models (actually less than half the price). The Matsumoku factory had been producing guitars for export for some time, but the 1820 bass (alongside a number of guitar models and the 5120 electric acoustic bass) were the first Epiphone models to be made there. These new Epiphones were based on existing Matsumoku guitars, sharing body shapes, and hardware, but the Epiphone line was somewhat upgraded, with inlaid logos and a 2x2 peghead configuration. Over the course of the 70s, the Japanese output improved dramatically, and in many ways these early 70s models are a low point for the brand. Having said this, there are a lot worse guitars out there, and as well as being historically important, the 1820 bass can certainly provide the goods when required.
1981 Gibson MarauderProduction of Bill Lawrence's Gibson Marauder began in 1974, with production peaking in 1978. But by 1980 the model was officially discontinued, though very small numbers slipped out as late as spring 1981. Over 7000 examples shipped between 1974 and 1979, and although no totals are available for 1980 and 1981, it is unlikely production reached three figures in either of these years. These final Marauders were all assembled at the Gibson Nashville plant, and had some nice features not available through the later years of production, such as a rosewood fretboard, and in this case, an opaque 'Devil Red' finish. It's a great looking and fine playing guitar!